Technical Discussion Topics related to Technical Issues

EBC Clutch Discs Suck!

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 12-01-2009 | 01:07 PM
  #31  
Tweety's Avatar
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Tweety is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by mikstr
as the curiosity is killing me, could you post just a quick overview of what you did? I am in search of similar numbers (my last dyno run had me making 113 hp and 71 lb-ft although airbox box mods carried out since then should have me slightly over 115 hp and 73 lb-ft, based on the dyno results I had obtained previously with the same mods). This, of course, is on a bike with over 75,000 miles on teh odometer. I will be freshening up the engine with OS JE pistons in the foreseeable future and hope to get up to @ 122hp and 80 lb-ft. I am intrigued at your 83 lb-ft, however......
Me thinks you horses are a bit lazy... I have 114/73...

BTW I owe you a kick in the behind... Or make that two...

You gave me stupid ideas when we last discussed airboxes... So naturally I had to go try, and once I cut out the center divider in the snorkle and smoothed out some wrinkles... and played with a few other things in there my jetting were completely FUBAR'ed...

If I hadn't already been an owner of an FC I'd probably have taken a flight over there to strangle you... Though once I did get it right it made a nice little +2hp/+3lb-ft vs before...

Oh BTW... Don't ask me why... But my bike likes BMC airfilters a lot better than K&N... Stock filter gives a nice smooth curve, the K&N makes big gaping holes that become small and annoying once you add the plastic airdam from the stock filter in there... But the BMC makes small holes with out that and nice smooth power with it, but breathes better than stock... My guess, it's in between, more open than stock but a tad more restrictive than K&N... This bike is touchy...

Last edited by Tweety; 12-01-2009 at 01:13 PM.
Old 12-01-2009 | 01:14 PM
  #32  
superchickencornermonster's Avatar
Thread Starter
Brooks' Cycle Centre'
Back Marker
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 166
From: Centreville, VA
superchickencornermonster is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by mikstr
It`s all good Am curious to see how one gets 83 lb-ft out of a VTR though (although I seem to recall Shayne`s buddy getting similar numbers with his M4 full system)...
I have not put on a full system, bored it out or messed with the cams yet, but that is coming this winter:

Here is what i have done so far:

Polished intake ports
Polished exhaust ports
Slip-On Exhaust (Scorpions)
Stage 2 jet kit with modified air box, K&N air filter
4 Deg. Time advancement
Down one tooth in the front (Go down in the front instead of up in the rear, makes for a shorter chain and you get about the same effect as up two in the rear.)

Polishing the ports probably made the biggest difference. I put a stage 1 on back in 2003 with the Scorpion pipes and it ran great, but not much power gain. After I polished the ports it ran like ****, so I had to dump some more fuel in to it and modify the box to let some more air in. It took awhile to tune it in and the gas mileage sucks (About 28 when I'm riding hard and 32 on the highway), but it's well worth it. I'm researching what else I can do to it in the upper end to get the most out of it. I have heard of some guys that race these things and get 140 + out of the rear wheel with over 90 ft. lbs. I don't think I'll ever get that crazy, I'm pretty sure that involves some **** that I cannot afford. Of course, I own a bike shop in Virginia, so I can get everything at cost and that helps alot!
Old 12-01-2009 | 01:19 PM
  #33  
superchickencornermonster's Avatar
Thread Starter
Brooks' Cycle Centre'
Back Marker
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 166
From: Centreville, VA
superchickencornermonster is on a distinguished road
All the other stuff that I've done is non-engine related:

Steel brake/clutch lines, LED kit, Pro Shift kit, Sonic Springs, Carbon-Fibre bits here and there (mostly fake) and a Dragon Sticker!
Old 12-01-2009 | 01:35 PM
  #34  
Tweety's Avatar
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Tweety is on a distinguished road
Um... Stock cams, stock juggs with port & polish to the top end, and you get 118/83? You sure that dyno wasn't set to happy mode?!

Stock you get 102 +/- 2hp or there abouts on the wheel, 110/71 at the crank... I have worked myself up to 114/73 at the wheel, but that takes cams, port & polish and a lot of intake mods amongs other stuff, none of it cheap...
Old 12-01-2009 | 02:11 PM
  #35  
mikstr's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
mikstr is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by Tweety
Me thinks you horses are a bit lazy... I have 114/73...

BTW I owe you a kick in the behind... Or make that two...

You gave me stupid ideas when we last discussed airboxes... So naturally I had to go try, and once I cut out the center divider in the snorkle and smoothed out some wrinkles... and played with a few other things in there my jetting were completely FUBAR'ed...

If I hadn't already been an owner of an FC I'd probably have taken a flight over there to strangle you... Though once I did get it right it made a nice little +2hp/+3lb-ft vs before...
cool, I only shared it with you as I knew you to be a good tuner. Your findings conform mine, then. (BTW, you Swedes have a funny way of saying thank you, lol)

In terms of the lazy horses, I am certain one of the things keeping my numbers down is the mileage on the engine (120,000 + km). I am very confident that just the refreshing part of the forthcoming rebuild will give me a nice boost in power.
Old 12-01-2009 | 03:00 PM
  #36  
Tweety's Avatar
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Tweety is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by mikstr
cool, I only shared it with you as I knew you to be a good tuner. Your findings conform mine, then. (BTW, you Swedes have a funny way of saying thank you, lol)

In terms of the lazy horses, I am certain one of the things keeping my numbers down is the mileage on the engine (120,000 + km). I am very confident that just the refreshing part of the forthcoming rebuild will give me a nice boost in power.

M'kay... How about a good beer after the kicks then? Is that better?!

Good tuner?! Me?! Hah, I say! Stubborn with lot of time and equipped with a dyno in the backyard (and very tolerant neighbours) is a more accurate description...

It took me a whole afternoon and a good part of the evening to get it right... Admittedly my own idea to try stock-K&N-BMC filter... but it payed off...

Last edited by Tweety; 12-01-2009 at 03:03 PM.
Old 12-01-2009 | 03:12 PM
  #37  
Tweety's Avatar
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Tweety is on a distinguished road
BTW, just to balance things out in terms of the neighbours... This sunday my father and I spent 3-4 hours tuning in a "small" methanol V8 running mufflers... Kind of... It's making 1100 bhp right now...

My mother having been previously warned retreated to town for shopping with my sister in law... They later reported that we could be heard 9 km away as they walked out of one store, stopped in the parking lot, listened and looked at each other and hit another store... Knowing full well that we wheren't done...

My brother complained that our tuning affected his credit bill... Since he's responsible for blowing up the motor that this one replaces... Well... Serves him right...
Old 12-01-2009 | 04:00 PM
  #38  
Red_Liner740's Avatar
Senior Member
Back Marker
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 243
From: Toronto, Ontario
Red_Liner740 is on a distinguished road
ah man, here i am thinking you actually have a VTR that puts down crazy numbers...

sorry man, but how you got those numbers? the mods mentioned do nothing to the compression ratio, valve lift or duration. you've just improved slightly the intake track of the head....no way would that net u the numbers you stated.

Originally Posted by superchickencornermonster
I have not put on a full system, bored it out or messed with the cams yet, but that is coming this winter:

Here is what i have done so far:

Polished intake ports
Polished exhaust ports
Slip-On Exhaust (Scorpions)
Stage 2 jet kit with modified air box, K&N air filter
4 Deg. Time advancement
Down one tooth in the front (Go down in the front instead of up in the rear, makes for a shorter chain and you get about the same effect as up two in the rear.)

Polishing the ports probably made the biggest difference. I put a stage 1 on back in 2003 with the Scorpion pipes and it ran great, but not much power gain. After I polished the ports it ran like ****, so I had to dump some more fuel in to it and modify the box to let some more air in. It took awhile to tune it in and the gas mileage sucks (About 28 when I'm riding hard and 32 on the highway), but it's well worth it. I'm researching what else I can do to it in the upper end to get the most out of it. I have heard of some guys that race these things and get 140 + out of the rear wheel with over 90 ft. lbs. I don't think I'll ever get that crazy, I'm pretty sure that involves some **** that I cannot afford. Of course, I own a bike shop in Virginia, so I can get everything at cost and that helps alot!
Old 12-02-2009 | 07:49 AM
  #39  
mikstr's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
mikstr is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by Tweety
Me thinks you horses are a bit lazy... I have 114/73...

BTW I owe you a kick in the behind... Or make that two...

You gave me stupid ideas when we last discussed airboxes... So naturally I had to go try, and once I cut out the center divider in the snorkle and smoothed out some wrinkles... and played with a few other things in there my jetting were completely FUBAR'ed...

If I hadn't already been an owner of an FC I'd probably have taken a flight over there to strangle you... Though once I did get it right it made a nice little +2hp/+3lb-ft vs before...

Oh BTW... Don't ask me why... But my bike likes BMC airfilters a lot better than K&N... Stock filter gives a nice smooth curve, the K&N makes big gaping holes that become small and annoying once you add the plastic airdam from the stock filter in there... But the BMC makes small holes with out that and nice smooth power with it, but breathes better than stock... My guess, it's in between, more open than stock but a tad more restrictive than K&N... This bike is touchy...
Hey Markus,

here are more goodies to get you going. I placed two small washers per side between the airbox lid and airdam, opening up the gap slightly to permit better airflow to the filter. So have at it and get back to us with the results

cheers
Old 12-02-2009 | 09:12 AM
  #40  
superchickencornermonster's Avatar
Thread Starter
Brooks' Cycle Centre'
Back Marker
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 166
From: Centreville, VA
superchickencornermonster is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by Red_Liner740
ah man, here i am thinking you actually have a VTR that puts down crazy numbers...

sorry man, but how you got those numbers? the mods mentioned do nothing to the compression ratio, valve lift or duration. you've just improved slightly the intake track of the head....no way would that net u the numbers you stated.
There was a local shop here that was doing a big promotion and had a portable dyno machine. Something like $20 per run. Just a quick run that shows hp, torque, top speed, etc.. If what you guys are saying is accurate I may have to go get my money back.
Old 12-02-2009 | 09:15 AM
  #41  
Tweety's Avatar
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Tweety is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by mikstr
Hey Markus,

here are more goodies to get you going. I placed two small washers per side between the airbox lid and airdam, opening up the gap slightly to permit better airflow to the filter. So have at it and get back to us with the results

cheers
Nu-uh! No-way... Not happening...

I have a new project to keep me occupied... Besides the spare engine for the superhawk that I'm rebuilding with... well... extra everything I think about covers it...

I'm building an EV... Small car - engine + electric motor from forklift and a bunch of batteries... It makes for stupendous burnouts as it has full torque from 0 rpm...
Old 12-02-2009 | 09:18 AM
  #42  
mikstr's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
mikstr is on a distinguished road
and here I thought you were a team player, lol
Old 12-03-2009 | 01:23 AM
  #43  
Tweety's Avatar
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Tweety is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by mikstr
Hey Markus,

here are more goodies to get you going. I placed two small washers per side between the airbox lid and airdam, opening up the gap slightly to permit better airflow to the filter. So have at it and get back to us with the results

cheers
I really don't like you you know... Now you got me thinking again... And I though I was done fiddling for a while...

Dammit, I can get enough ideas on my own without you helping me along...
Old 12-03-2009 | 02:25 AM
  #44  
E.Marquez's Avatar
Administrator
MotoGP
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,402
From: Kempner, TX
E.Marquez is on a distinguished road
EBC clutch drive disks are notorious for poor life and crappy consistency in both wear and inconsistent fit. Clutch stack height is not only often different then OEM disks, but the EBC clutch parts will very production run to production run.
OEM drive disks are a great deal when bought on line though one of the parts houses at a decent price, wear good and fit is spot on.

On the other hand, I use and recommend EBC brake products

Last edited by E.Marquez; 12-03-2009 at 02:27 AM.
Old 12-03-2009 | 06:36 AM
  #45  
mikstr's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
mikstr is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by Tweety
I really don't like you you know... Now you got me thinking again... And I though I was done fiddling for a while...

Dammit, I can get enough ideas on my own without you helping me along...
What are friends for anyhow? If it makes you feel any better, you got me thinking about a BMC air filter... To make matters worse, the stret or race version???????
Old 12-03-2009 | 09:10 AM
  #46  
Tweety's Avatar
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Tweety is on a distinguished road
I dunno... I'll look at it once I break down and try your suggestion...
Old 12-03-2009 | 09:31 AM
  #47  
mikstr's Avatar
Senior Member
MotoGP
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,631
From: Montreal
mikstr is on a distinguished road
there you go, there is the Markus we know, he he
Old 12-03-2009 | 11:50 AM
  #48  
Tweety's Avatar
Out of my mind, back in 5
MotoGP
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 6,109
From: Skurup, Sweden
Tweety is on a distinguished road
Originally Posted by mikstr
there you go, there is the Markus we know, he he
Hah... And people tell me I have problems with impulse control...
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Old Yeller
Ebay
0
12-22-2010 08:41 AM
Red_Liner740
Classifieds
3
11-04-2010 07:59 PM
gronno
Classifieds
0
06-29-2009 01:30 PM
salmanilla2000
Modifications - Performance
0
09-17-2008 07:09 PM
AMF Racing
Modifications - Performance
1
09-26-2007 09:17 PM




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:13 PM.