Brake Lines
07-15-2009 | 12:45 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Member
Squid
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 42
From: Windsor Colorado
Brake Lines
Just want any suggestions on steel braided brake lines. If anybody has suggestions, what they prefer, and general prices. I have an 04' Hawk with stock brakes. ( don't know if they changed the setup at all over the years??) I want to start by doing steel lines,and seeing if would help the hawk stop any better. Thanks
07-15-2009 | 12:47 PM
#2
Senior Member
Superstock
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 388
From: Muskego,WI
I have russell lines all around. got them from DennisKirk.com for $ 54 for the front and $ 26 for the rear.
I suggest getting some RC51 Calipers and Master Cylinder to go with those lines... It will stop night and day different. there are numerous setups that will work on the Hawk as many will chime in with.
I suggest getting some RC51 Calipers and Master Cylinder to go with those lines... It will stop night and day different. there are numerous setups that will work on the Hawk as many will chime in with.
07-15-2009 | 01:17 PM
#3
Thread Starter
Member
Squid
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 42
From: Windsor Colorado
Thanks skoshere, did you change the brake lines with your stock setup, and then convert to the RC-51 calipers and 954 MC later? Just curious if I'll notice any difference in the braking keeping the stock setup + steel lines. What kind of pads are you using? Thanks
07-15-2009 | 01:32 PM
#4
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
Well I went from stock brakes to a 954 setup with stainless lines, then to a F4i setup with stainless lines.. My buddy has a F4i setup with stock Superhawk lines, and to be honest his stock lines with F4i master and calipers are every bit as good as mine.. I don't think the stainless lines make much if any difference. (they do force you to bleed the brakes and flush the system though.. that probably is the bigger difference)
F4i calipers have the largest pistons of any of the Honda ones that fit our bike and also have the most options for aftermarket brake pads available for them. So my recommendation is to upgrade to these. (plus they are not that pricey off ebay)
Edit: BTW the F4i system is night and day better than the 954 setup, which was much better than the stock system.
F4i calipers have the largest pistons of any of the Honda ones that fit our bike and also have the most options for aftermarket brake pads available for them. So my recommendation is to upgrade to these. (plus they are not that pricey off ebay)
Edit: BTW the F4i system is night and day better than the 954 setup, which was much better than the stock system.
Last edited by lazn; 07-15-2009 at 01:50 PM.
07-15-2009 | 01:39 PM
#5
Senior Member
Superstock
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 388
From: Muskego,WI
I had the stock and then went to everything.... I noticed a huge difference...
figure -
$ 50 - 70 for the calipers
$ 20 - 50 for the master cylinder
$ 50 - 100 for the front brake lines
$ 75 for EBC HH pads
Total up cost appx. 200 dollars...
It is so worth it.
figure -
$ 50 - 70 for the calipers
$ 20 - 50 for the master cylinder
$ 50 - 100 for the front brake lines
$ 75 for EBC HH pads
Total up cost appx. 200 dollars...
It is so worth it.
07-15-2009 | 01:55 PM
#7
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
07-15-2009 | 02:41 PM
#9
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
07-15-2009 | 02:49 PM
#11
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
While I would agree on principal, you can get a full F4i setup off ebay for less $ than new ss lines and they would give more of a improvement.. Bang for your buck upgrade to the F4i calipers and MC first, then do the lines if you feel you need them. (though the lines will work with either set of calipers, so I guess order isn't that important if you plan to upgrade eventually)
07-15-2009 | 03:30 PM
#13
Thread Starter
Member
Squid
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 42
From: Windsor Colorado
Thanks guys, I'll start looking on ebay for a F4I set. Do they mount up to the Hawk easily, or are there more parts required for installation? Love the bike, it wants to go fast, I just wished it stopped like my 2004 1000rr.
07-15-2009 | 03:36 PM
#14
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ad.php?t=18090
07-15-2009 | 03:50 PM
#16
Banned
MotoGP
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 5,942
From: Lake View Terrace, CA
The forks extended length does change when you install new fork springs. I've run standard length lines on my SH for 10yrs now with no issues.
07-17-2009 | 12:40 AM
#19
Senior Member
SuperSport
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 963
From: Sunshine Coast, Australia
Stainless lines are great, much better that OEM lines.
But they will not make your VTR stop well. I fitted stainless lines and good pads and was not happy until I fitted a CBR600F4i master cylinder and calipers. NOW I have brakes!!!!!!!
If you want to try the lines first, they will fit on the CBR stuff as well if you swap them later.
And my preference for lines is Spiegler, as they have an adjustable banjo fitting. This is great for getting the lines to sit neatly with no twists in them.
But they will not make your VTR stop well. I fitted stainless lines and good pads and was not happy until I fitted a CBR600F4i master cylinder and calipers. NOW I have brakes!!!!!!!
If you want to try the lines first, they will fit on the CBR stuff as well if you swap them later.
And my preference for lines is Spiegler, as they have an adjustable banjo fitting. This is great for getting the lines to sit neatly with no twists in them.
07-17-2009 | 10:15 AM
#21
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
It would work, but you would not gain the advantages of the larger caliper pistons, so you would have less lever movement, and less braking strength.
The F4, F4i, 600RR, RC51, 929RR, 954RR calipers are all externally identical, and they need slight grinding to clear the mounting bracket on the VTR fork leg. Other than that, they bolt on and work quite well. The caliper piston and master cylinder sizes vary from model to model and year to year. Here is a little chart I stole from another post with all the data.
2003-2004 CBR600RR mc 11/16” (17.4625 mm)
caliper pistons 32mm/30mm
2000-2001 CBR929RR mc 19mm
caliper pistons 34mm/30mm
2002-2003 CBR954RR mc 11/16” (17.4625 mm)
caliper pistons 32mm/30mm
2000-2001 RC51 mc 19mm
caliper pistons 34mm/32mm
2002-present RC51 mc 11/16” (17.4625 mm)
caliper pistons 32mm/30mm
1999-Present CBR600F4(i) mc 5/8” (15.87mm)
caliper pistons 34mm/32mm
Stock VTR Master Cylinder 14mm
caliper pistons 30mm/27mm
edit: You can see from this list why the RC51 and F4i calipers are the preferred ones. As for the Master Cyl you choose to match it: Larger MC = less lever movement and faster, while smaller MC = more lever movement and strength. (from increased leverage)
The F4, F4i, 600RR, RC51, 929RR, 954RR calipers are all externally identical, and they need slight grinding to clear the mounting bracket on the VTR fork leg. Other than that, they bolt on and work quite well. The caliper piston and master cylinder sizes vary from model to model and year to year. Here is a little chart I stole from another post with all the data.
2003-2004 CBR600RR mc 11/16” (17.4625 mm)
caliper pistons 32mm/30mm
2000-2001 CBR929RR mc 19mm
caliper pistons 34mm/30mm
2002-2003 CBR954RR mc 11/16” (17.4625 mm)
caliper pistons 32mm/30mm
2000-2001 RC51 mc 19mm
caliper pistons 34mm/32mm
2002-present RC51 mc 11/16” (17.4625 mm)
caliper pistons 32mm/30mm
1999-Present CBR600F4(i) mc 5/8” (15.87mm)
caliper pistons 34mm/32mm
Stock VTR Master Cylinder 14mm
caliper pistons 30mm/27mm
edit: You can see from this list why the RC51 and F4i calipers are the preferred ones. As for the Master Cyl you choose to match it: Larger MC = less lever movement and faster, while smaller MC = more lever movement and strength. (from increased leverage)
Last edited by lazn; 07-17-2009 at 10:21 AM.
07-17-2009 | 04:39 PM
#25
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
2001-2002 GSXR 1000 6 pot calipers are a direct bolt on replacement no grinding necessary.
But only those two years, and only GSXR 1000s. So they are pricey.
Other years and models have a different spacing and won't bolt up to our forks. (test them before you take the brake lines off your stock ones Swordfish or you will be bleeding your brakes when you find out they won't work)
But only those two years, and only GSXR 1000s. So they are pricey.
Other years and models have a different spacing and won't bolt up to our forks. (test them before you take the brake lines off your stock ones Swordfish or you will be bleeding your brakes when you find out they won't work)
Last edited by lazn; 07-17-2009 at 04:41 PM.
07-17-2009 | 05:28 PM
#26
Senior Member
SuperSport
SuperSport
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 809
From: North Wales, PA
2001-2002 GSXR 1000 6 pot calipers are a direct bolt on replacement no grinding necessary.
But only those two years, and only GSXR 1000s. So they are pricey.
Other years and models have a different spacing and won't bolt up to our forks. (test them before you take the brake lines off your stock ones Swordfish or you will be bleeding your brakes when you find out they won't work)
But only those two years, and only GSXR 1000s. So they are pricey.
Other years and models have a different spacing and won't bolt up to our forks. (test them before you take the brake lines off your stock ones Swordfish or you will be bleeding your brakes when you find out they won't work)
07-17-2009 | 05:55 PM
#27
Senior Member
SuperSport
SuperSport
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 809
From: North Wales, PA
I don't see anything on the chart that would suggest the 750's won't work either. shrug.
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ad.php?t=17615
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ad.php?t=17615
07-17-2009 | 07:23 PM
#28
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
I don't see anything on the chart that would suggest the 750's won't work either. shrug.
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ad.php?t=17615
https://www.superhawkforum.com/forum...ad.php?t=17615
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=455430
but I did the research back before I did my fork swap and found that they had a different spacing. (ours are spaced like the GSXR1000 and SV650 but not the GSXR750)
But I could have found faulty info, the internet being what it is, you can easily try it (just two bolts) without removing the brake line and if it fits, go ahead with the swap.
Last edited by lazn; 07-17-2009 at 09:45 PM.
07-17-2009 | 10:16 PM
#29
Senior Member
MotoGP
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,132
From: Phoenix, AZ
Update.. You are probably ok. Yay!
I found this:
I found this:
In the earlier gen, SRAD (96-99 for the 750, 97-00 for the 600, no thou) the 600s have 4-pots and the 750s have 6-pots. They're interchangable- the SRAD 600 4-pots will mount to an SRAD 750 front fork, and so on. I think all TL1000S and Busas (as far as 2006 anyway) will come into the same generation, with the TL1000S having 4s and the R having 6, and all Busas having 6.
Then, you get the next gen, which is Y-K3 750, K1-K2 thou, and... Eh, K1-K3 600? In this, the 600s and 750s both have 4-pots, while the thou has 6s. Doug's is a perfect example of this, 750 vs thou. Again, full compatability within the generations.
Then, you get the next gen, which is Y-K3 750, K1-K2 thou, and... Eh, K1-K3 600? In this, the 600s and 750s both have 4-pots, while the thou has 6s. Doug's is a perfect example of this, 750 vs thou. Again, full compatability within the generations.
