tweety i respect your thoughts and experience,but I have to disagree..

You can't say that taking corners at 140/160 km/h with the CBR 600RR at 9000 RPM i was CRUISING. I'm not an experienced pilot. But I believe to ride sporty you don't have to go past 12.000 RPM in gear change and drag the knee down.

If I were to take corners at 80 /100 km/h at 6000 RPM on the 600 RR,yes, you might say that I was going gentle on it.

But NOBODY on this forum can convince me that you have to be more carefull with the throttle on a 4L like the 600RR than on a VTR 1000 F.

If you hit a ****** bump in the road and your hand is not eased on the throttle, try to compare the consequences on the VTR F vs. 600 RR.

If I'm riding the VTR at 4500 RPM (pretty much cruising RPM) and I hit a bump,there is no need for my wrist to travel much for that VTR to hit 6000 RPM, at which range will ******* pull you.

On the other hand, If I cruise at 4000 4500 RPM on the 600RR, if I hit that bump, resulting in a RPM increase to 6000, I don't think the pull will be that substantial (as yourselves stated ,that bike 'really' pulls from 10.000 rpm or so).

When I say that the VTR is twitchy I mean it takes LESS to reach the peak torque band, than on other bikes => hence => needs more attention to the throttle.

Having bad roads, with dust,sand & all that crap I know how important is a gentle & steady hand on the throttle on a bike like VTR when entering a bend that surprises you with some dust particles / sand. And you don't need to be doing much speed to be in trouble, and you don't need a 'beach of sand' to be in trouble. Just a speck of dust and the back will lose it.

You can have much fun with a 600RR / GSX R 750 on twisty roads,without needing to go over 9000 RPM, and you still have pull and feeling and not have to worry it will bite you.

On the VTR in the other hand,if you're already around 6000 RPM,you have to be carefull,especially in the bends..

The HAWK's ride is comfy,is ok, it's not aggressive. The difference between the VTR F and other bikes,the striking difference,is engine behaviour/output.

 

Honda NT 700V. I picked it over the Suzuki because of shaft drive and my girlfriend and I can ride comfortably as we weigh less than 300 lbs. together. I have the Superhawk and my RD 400 for me. The NT 700 can usually be found well under sticker price putting it close to the Suzuki. And the NT handles really well.

 

Have you considered Moto Guzzi?

I know the dealership network is light, but the mothership (Piaggio) seems to be getting it's act together.

And they make some great bikes that seem to meet your criteria. Based on your requirements, I would suggest that you check out the 1200 Sport, Breva and Norge models. Oh yeah try out the new 8V Griso too. Now THERE is a motorcycle that speaks to me. Even their cruiser models will outhandle and out perform most other metric and US cruisers.

A well sorted Guzzi is a joy to ride. I know, I've accumulated almost 300,000km on the two that I have owned (1985 T5 - 240,000km, 2004 EV - 45,000km). The EV is the bike that replaced my 'Storm when I retired and my life slooowwwwwwwed down.

There is a terrific owners club (MGNOC) and online owner support on sites like Wildgoosechase and Guzzitech.

Parts are generally a phone call or two away.

My $.02.

Good Luck and Good Hunting!

G

PS My buddy had to replace the clutch in his Monster DS this spring (40,000km) - cough, gulp, gasp.......you want HOW MUCH??????? And you say that this is REGULAR maintainence????? Ducatis are expensive to run. I'm just sayin.....

 

I'm dreaming of a Monster S4r,but as you said, running one will empty my pockets (not to mention the price of the bike).

 

First off, the way I define cruising isn't solely related to speed... I can cruise all day at 160 kph or more if I find a road with open enough bends... It's the simple act of keeping a smooth near constant speed that I define as cruising...

If you are on a CBR or GSXR and keep the revs down, you get smooth, lazy power, ie cruisning, not fast acceleration... Then you set your speed by what gear you are in... Same thing on a VTR, the only difference is the RPM's depending on engine type...

No, you don't have to go above 12k, and you don't have to go above 8k on the VTR either to ride "sporty"... It's just a matter of scale here...

A V2 has a shorter rev range, so it's no surprise that if you "accidentally" hit it's ceiling it will throw a hissy fit at you, just like the IL4's will if you hit their RPM cieling...

 

@Tweety: Cruising is not given by riding at a SPECIFIC speed, but more of a specific type of riding.

I didn't say I was doing 160 km/h constantly on wide-wide boring bends and keeping the throttle constant.

It was a whole set of accelerations/braking on those twists while on the CBR 600RR.
As I said, you can go sporty on bends/twisties with a 4L, without exceeding 9000 RPM, and still accelerate & brake down in a manner that still feels sporty.

The range where I felt good riding the VTR in the bends was 6000-7000 RPM, 3rd, 4th (or 5th), matching the speed to the corner.... I rarely pushed it beyond 8000 rpm.

 

This is kinda like an oil thread. LOL




Actually, in reading through your posts, it seems like you are both saying similar things, but viewing/describing it from a different point of view. big twins like ours (or i-4 liter bikes for that matter) are more prone to spin up the rear tire if you are ham-fisted on the throttle. 600s are a bit more forgiving in that regard because the power isn't there as much. All things are relative, of course.

I was running a 600 on the track and my very first time on the hawk taught me a valuable lesson about throttle smoothness. I have scrapes on the butt of my leathers to prove it.

 

Old Yeller you just proved me right, regarding the smoothness on the throttle, or should we say,your butt proved me

 

I don’t care if you’re riding a CM400, when you hit the power band it will wake you up. If you don’t know where the engine takes off, sure, you will hit it when you aren’t ready and it will scare you.

My old RD 400 had a band as thin as a razor and you could drive all day under or above it and never know how much vertical lift you could get in the sweet spot. My experience of I4s is very similar though the overall power band is wider on both ends.

This doesn’t make them more or less dangerous. One of the reasons two-strokes are so good for beginner sport bike riders is because you learn where your power is and how to exploit it. The very thing that makes them so wheelie pone / scary to new riders is what more experienced folks relish – that is being able to play with the engine’s dynamics.

So here’s the problem: If you don’t like low-end power bands, don’t get a V-Twin or most singles. (Some singles ride more like parallel twins, which have an entirely different power characteristic, believe it or not.) The Buell I had was much more responsive off throttle in the low revs and this has been the case with Ducatis I’ve ridden, too.

The SV and Hawk GT are gentler, but I’m afraid that you’re a bit of a size queen and won’t be happy with a smaller machine. If you want a lazy bike with a wide power band, look at the VFR or I3s. Go for the earlier VFRs or the later Triumphs so you aren’t shocked by the weight.

The VTR is probably the most user friendly, forgiving twin I’ve been on… It’s a bike I’d let my wife drive, really a bigger faster version of the Hawk GT, a tad more involving than the SVs I’ve been on. I ride it like a fast road bike and couldn’t be happier. If you want something else, you just need to map it out and do some test rides, imho.

CR

 

@Crashrat: I'm not a size queen and I've said it myself that I wanna get a bike which will attract a different style of riding, a sort of bike like the naked SV or the Ducati Monster, if you know what I mean.
After riding the VTR I really don't know if I can ride the SV, because I'm afraid I will perceive it as a bit dull. But these are just opinions. To make up my mind I will test ride both the SV 1000 N and the 650 N. Perhaps after test riding them both I'll feel that the 650 N is enough and fun and suitable for my touring ideas, or perhaps I'll feel that it's underpowered for my taste and I'll want a more bigger/stable torquey bike like the 1000 N. Let's be honest, it's not like the 1000 N is some soft of ZX10R. If you say the VTR 1000 F is a forgiving bike, I believe the SV is even more docile, having a more tamed version of the TL engine.

You guys keep arguing with me as if I said the VTR is a dangerous bike.
No,it is not.
The VTR was the first bike I ever rode and if you take care of it,it won't bite. But it's a bike on which an unexperienced rider must be CAREFUL with the throttle...
As I said before, I like the triumph.. it's a bit expensive for me, so I'll stick with my love for twins...

 

Well, the TL wasn't famed for it's docile temper... So saying the SV is a tamer version isn't saying much... The SV is a bit more towards the IL4 type of powerband (less linear) than the VTR (very linear)... Just trying a different version of describing the power, since while we are talking about the same thing and describing it differently, we also have different preferences...

Ie even if the SV1000 is a twin, it's more docile at the bottom, and has a bigger top end rush, compared to the VTR... And the RPM cieling isn't a great deal higher, so it's just as capable of wagging it's tail as the VTR if you aren't careful with the throttle...

 

Just want to sum up what I was getting from your thoughts...

Here's the thing, too, and I'm sure it has crossed your mind: You can get a smaller bike, ride it for a couple of years, re-sell it pretty much what you paid for it, and upgrade. It's not like if you get an SV650 or monster 620 that it will be your last bike... but if you get a large one it could be . Hell, if you get an SV1000, what are you going to upgrade to in a couple of years?

And find some new riding friends... there are definitely groups around here that have invited me to ride wheelies down the highway at 90mph while others block the cars... I just turn those rides down...

 

Tweety: I admit, I haven't ridden the SV 1000 N yet, but everywhere I've read about it says it's a more tamed beast than the TL. You misunderstood my post.
The TL was famous for his punchy engine and crappy rear suspension.
The SV is a refined version of the TL, refined as in the power is delivered more smooth, and the suspension ride has been much improved.

I've also read that when compared to the SV 1000, the VTR, even if it has less power (110 hp instead of 120 and 96 nM torque instead of 102 nM), people say that the VTR feels like it has more 'unf' (perhaps being on carbs & etc).
I doubt it that the SV is docile at the bottom and that somehow having bigger rush at the top end, I believe it has some sort of linear pull...

As I said, this is what I've read all over the place, I didn't ride both bikes,to be able to speak from experience..

 

@7moore7: agreed. Will definitely test out the SV650N. I don't wanna limit my options due to ego or stupidity. I wanna make the right call.