http://buell.com/en_us/

No matter what you think of H-D this is dissapointing from a motorcycle enthusiast standpoint.

I'd say it's dissapointing from any standpoint... I didn't feel their bikes was right for me, but they where still really nice bikes with a bit of that oddball quirkiness to them that makes them special...

Goddammit this sucks. Once again we have no stateside sportbike builder.

I've always admired Erik Buell. He sounds devastated. I'm really sorry Buell is gone.

Harley continues to amaze me in the Milwaukee area. from closing its Capitol Drive plant to now Buell.

Soon Harley will be in China and Mexico not Milwaukee. aside from the huge economic loss, I say good riddance to a horrible company.

they for some reason have this voodoo trance on people with their bikes, why that is I dont know... hopefully people see what they really are!!!!

Once again we have no stateside sportbike builder.

http://www.fischer1.com/
http://www.roehrmotorcycles.com/

It does suck to see him close shop. Touching speech. +1, the bikes just didn't appeal to me. I was excited to hear they were switching to Rotax, but the looks of that bike is horrible.

I have always been a huge fan of cross grain type thinking, especially when it works. I thought buell did a great job with what they had available to them. I think in a few more years with the right funding they could have really made a difference.

Oh and Harley introduced 9 more models this year, none of which I can see much difference other than "that one has bags".

This is a real shame. I know a guy that has worked with Eric and says that he is very inovative yet extremely stubborn lol. I thought the new motor was really going to turn things around. They really have been struggling for years, but not like this. Wonder where Danny Eslick will go to? He was killing it this year in the formula extreme or what ever that class is called now. Buell will be missed..

This is not good. The big-3 fiasco earlier this year was bad. This is more of the same underlying issue. Things are going to get much, much worse before they get better. Expect atrocious numbers for Christmas sales in retail, etc, etc. Not trying to sound too doom and gloom, but this is a bad thing, and a harbinger of worse things to come.

+10 on that no more Pontiac, Saturn, Buell and there will be others. De Simone BMW, Ducati in Cherry Hill NJ just anounced they wil be closing nov 25th.

By american before the chinese own it! Oh shit they already bought it. Who the f' is resposible for this. Find them and hang them!

Man that sucks. I test rode a XB12Ss, and it was a lot of fun. The bike handled really well, and even though it was the harley engine, it pulled hard and made a unique sound. I would have loved to try one of those buell bikes with the Rotax engine that would actually scream up to 10k RPM.

Not kewl

What the F is DMG gonna do now??

I wonder if this means that the 700cc Tariff will return!? Are the Ronnie Regan years of motorcycling back...http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa032.html

Not like we're missing much.
Hopefully AMA will at least be worth watching again.

What the F is DMG gonna do now??

at least the debate is over, letting the 1125r vtwin race with the 600 I4's. dumb a$$es.

if Erik didn't win the series he would have been laughed off the track ( with
such a large advantage... )

tim

wow. that blows big time. their latest CR edition of their sportsbike was really sounding very good as well. he sounds suicidal. tough break.

Crap! Makes me want to go out and buy one. It'll be a long time (if ever?) before a sportbike comes off our soil.

At least Harley is trying to trim costs to stay upright without making the taxpayers fund it. It's a tough market for them, a $20K motorcycle is the first thing to get crossed off someone's list when they have no job or a rising mortgage payment.

H-D - over-priced & over-produced.

Hopefully someone will pick up the company & keep it going.

I have always been a huge fan of cross grain type thinking, especially when it works. I thought buell did a great job with what they had available to them. I think in a few more years with the right funding they could have really made a difference.

Oh and Harley introduced 9 more models this year, none of which I can see much difference other than "that one has bags".

+1

this is so typical. HD thows away the only bikes that had any real value, and keeps the crap. I guess I shouldn't be surprised since it seems the majority of HD riders are well suited for their "bikes" (if thats what you want to call them) and few HD riders appreciated buells on the whole. no knock on HD riders here. if you are here, then you aren't who I'm talking about. but nobody can deny, that harley riders have more posers in their ranks than the customers of any other bike company. just a shame that harley opted to support them rather than the customers that actually like to RIDE. I guess the money is in replacing parts. not making bikes that are high enough quality to actually run for a while(ie. Buells). no money there. good representation of an american bike company and the retards that run it. I'd rather have a korean pos than american now. hope they die of syphilis.

And yet HD is still bailing water with MV Agusta. I wonder if the money they invested in MV could have kept Buell afloat long enough to ride out this depression, oops, recession.

And the fat cats on Wall & Main Street are laddeling out $153billion in bonuses at 23 companies using our bailout money!

The press release states that H-D is also putting MV up for sale

this is so typical. HD thows away the only bikes that had any real value, and keeps the crap. I guess I shouldn't be surprised since it seems the majority of HD riders are well suited for their "bikes" (if thats what you want to call them) and few HD riders appreciated buells on the whole.

Well, those "posers" as you call them are what keep H-D in business. It would be stupid of them to keep Buell and cut a more profitable part of the lineup.

It's an uphill battle for them anyways, because of people (and perhaps you) trashing on their products based on a few 2nd hand stories rather than actual experience.

GM has been fighting that stigma for the past 10 years. Even if they built the best damn car in the history of mankind, lots of people would still assume it was crap and not buy it, and then tell everyone else the same.

The press release states that H-D is also putting MV up for sale

No PR posted above, got a link?

No PR posted above, got a link?

http://www.motorcycledaily.com/15october09_hddiscontinues.htm

Well, those "posers" as you call them are what keep H-D in business. It would be stupid of them to keep Buell and cut a more profitable part of the lineup.

It's an uphill battle for them anyways, because of people (and perhaps you) trashing on their products based on a few 2nd hand stories rather than actual experience.

GM has been fighting that stigma for the past 10 years. Even if they built the best damn car in the history of mankind, lots of people would still assume it was crap and not buy it, and then tell everyone else the same.

I don't think its the "trashing" causing sales losses at HD... its over saturation and the fact they aren't attracting the next gen. Even HD know this, that was the reason for Buell in the first place. And forget 2nd hand stories I have ridden a Harley and my opinion is it sucked. Now if it is what you want to ride I don't care, its just not the bike for me. I hope HD contiues to build bikes, they are a staple of American culture even if we don't like their bikes.

I'm bummed about this. Buell showed that design doesn't have to be conventional. Though I wouldn't have bought one with the Evolution motor, the Rotax was pretty attractive. Too bad it got off on the wrong foot. I hope that the 1125 and Uly can survive somehow.

GM could build the worlds best cars - and yes we (or at least I) would still bash them. How many years does it take to remove the stink of 3 decades of shit? Quite a few - and I'm not ready to forget.
I think "buy American" was partially to blame. Americans would buy American cars on principle and that fostered te sence of entitlement that GM Chrysler and Ford had. They thought the US consumer would always accept their crap. Turns out they were wrong. It is disgusting that our money was used to bail them out.
I feel bad for Buell. It is the only American bike I ever thought might interest me. Maybe Eric or others in that organization will have a chance to rebuild a smaller leaner company. It was a niche product and I guess ultimately sales volume could not support organization

I've owned two Buells and thought they were great bikes. Sad to see them go. Kinda wish I still had that pearl white S2 with WP wheels.

GM could build the worlds best cars - and yes we (or at least I) would still bash them. How many years does it take to remove the stink of 3 decades of shit? Quite a few - and I'm not ready to forget.
I think "buy American" was partially to blame. Americans would buy American cars on principle and that fostered te sence of entitlement that GM Chrysler and Ford had. They thought the US consumer would always accept their crap. Turns out they were wrong. It is disgusting that our money was used to bail them out.
I feel bad for Buell. It is the only American bike I ever thought might interest me. Maybe Eric or others in that organization will have a chance to rebuild a smaller leaner company. It was a niche product and I guess ultimately sales volume could not support organization

http://www.jsonline.com/business/64352232.html

http://www.wherethepoweris.com/news_article.asp?id=1335

http://www.harley-davidson.com/wcm/Content/Pages/H-D_History/history_1990s.jsp?locale=en_US

http://www.buell.com/en_us/

http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/buell-family-general-discussion/158710-buell-dead.html

http://www.answers.com/topic/harley-davidson

http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/history-buell-motorcycle.html

In 1993 I met with Erik in his office after a tour of the plant. I was there because 49% of Buell was being bought by HD and he finally would had some money to hire some engineers. It was interesting when I asked Erik what the long term impact on his company HD would have. His responses were telling. I later interviewed with the HD man who was coming on-board. Can’t remember his name but I think he is now upstairs at HD.

Comparing the US auto industry to Buell is not quite apples and oranges but when Erik sold out completely and then stepped back as primarily head of design, the writing was on the wall.

Rotax I’m sure is surprised! Maybe they will play a factor in what becomes of their partnership, or some other Euro consortium. Kind of reverse MV Agusta. Which was my dream bike when I was a mere boy and the Count was still in charge.

It is sad to see them go. They are amazingly quirky and niche just like the superhawk. Most people just dont get the love of these types of bikes. I have a friend that rides one and the thing has never let him down and was always right there when we went riding. Now on the other hand. The 1125 was 6 feet wide and hard to fit into normal parking spaces.... Kinda killed the edgy cool looks for me. I had the chance to take one out on a track in the last 6 months for a demo... It was stupid quick with tons of tourqe. It was as powerful as the ducati streetfighter i had rode earlier. But after 1 lap it started cutting out.... Lap 2 it was done and rolled to the infield.... and died that slow painful death of many other buells.

Wow!

Well I heard a rumor about this last week but I didn't put any faith in it.

For what its worth I think that Buells have allways been the black sheep. Sportsbike style with an anchor for a motor. Great innovation, functional new ideas.

Then I saw the 1125R and my attitude changed. With the Rotax motor they couldnt go wrong. Finally a motor that fits the rest of the bike. With the faring kit it looks GOOD too!

I am saddened to see that Buell has closed its doors. I wish HD would have put more of there $ into Buell.

Saddened

GM could build the worlds best cars - and yes we (or at least I) would still bash them.

Thanks for being honest.

So you have no problem bashing a product that you have no experience with, even if it is actually a good product?

It takes decades to remove the stink of bad products PRECISELY because people keep regurgitating crap whether it's true or not. It goes the other way with all these import brand leghumpers. Brand loyalty or disloyalty is just plain stupid.

I have to jump in here.

GM, FoMoCo & Chrysler can build world beaters (but they don't) but I still wouldn't buy one because of the totally negative experiences I had with American dealerships from all three brands that I had to interact with because of company leasing. Eighteen years of being lied to, cheated on with service and buck passing has left a bitter taste where pride in the USA should be.

Wave the flag if you must but GM dealers and service managers won't see me in their shop again.

"They all do that". (Then let me borrow that one over there for an hour. "NO!")
"It comes from the factory with that noise".
"Those parts are on back order". (I finally got called three months after the lease expired)
"The guy who can fix it is on vacation". (And never came back)
"Your transmission needs rebuilt". (It was actually front wheel bearings)

Our company owner and the fleet contractor were patriotic and bought American for field service and sales. Cost a fortune in down time and maintenance because of greed and incompetence at the dealer level. I finally got a stipend for a car, bought an Accord and never looked back.

There is no emotion in money. What is GM stock selling for now?

Call me an 'import leghumper' but I actually get to point B when I need to be there.

Wave the flag if you must...

I am not waving any flags!!!

I'm simply saying don't knock it until you've tried it (or at least done your research.) I completely agree that you should buy the best thing for your money and conscience. Yes, it is unfortunate that the big 3 rode the wave of brand loyalty for so long, and it has finally bit them in the ass. But if people keep riding the wave of everything imported is the shiznit, they'll soon find there is nothing domestic left to purchase.

FWIW, I bought a new F150 in 2005 and loved it except for a few warranty issues that came up. But every experience at both dealerships I went to was a bad experience. It was the primary reason for me selling it 2 years later. I didn't see the point in paying for a warranty if they were unable/unwilling to repair it. (I have no experience from another brand to compare with.) Also I didn't want to be stuck 10 years from now trying to fix this unnecessarily overcomplicated crap myself (that would've applied to any brand of newer vehicle though). I "traded" it for a 1969 Chevy pickup and never looked back. I don't need or want automatic climate control and seat belt chimes and all that other b.s.

Everyone here seems sad that Buell is gone, but how many of you bought one? How many of you considered buying one before getting something else? (I didn't either.) It seems like everytime Buell comes up in the groups I ride, it's the butt of a joke, unless an actual Buell rider happens to be around, then it's all compliments. It seems like the general concensus is that "American Sportbike" was always an oxymoron. Well, it definitely is now.

Well, those "posers" as you call them are what keep H-D in business. It would be stupid of them to keep Buell and cut a more profitable part of the lineup.

It's an uphill battle for them anyways, because of people (and perhaps you) trashing on their products based on a few 2nd hand stories rather than actual experience.

GM has been fighting that stigma for the past 10 years. Even if they built the best damn car in the history of mankind, lots of people would still assume it was crap and not buy it, and then tell everyone else the same.

This is perhaps one of the more accurate things I've read in a long time and I couldn't have said it better myself. THANK YOU!

Central - I think you and I are more similar in opinion than you think. Do I celebrate the decline of the american automotive industry? Absolutely not. Do I blindly believe the playing field is level with the all the subsidies Asian manufactures receive from their respective governments? Let alone the drag of the UAW?
There is no such thing as "fair" - only the loosers whine about that.
I have owned two fords the last, a 96 Taurus LX with the upgraded 200 V6. This car was vastly less refined than the '94 Accord that preceded it. The best thing I can say about it was it was I got it for 50% of new list coming off a 2 yr lease, it was not horrible and it lasted me the 100,000 miles of commuting miles that I needed it for. The 99 Accord that replaced it was far more refined.
I fault the engineers more than the assemblers, but then they were probably designing to a fairly low cost point - either that or they were incompetent.
I have never designed a car, but I think I could write the marketing spec of what the interior should be. Cheap switchgear, hard tactile plastics, exposed fasteners, etc. This car did not have to be crappy, but it was.
Brand loyalty? A bit - but that was learned over time. was I happy the Honda's were better? No. But I was happier with the Hondas.
I have nothing against Buell, I think their bikes looked interesting. I am sorry they are gone - but no, I never bought one either...

But I will also agree that the sad thing now is that after building the same goddamn stuff for years they now think they can come out with some better models and immediately turn things around. It doesn't work that way... It takes time. But the constant assumption that everything domestic is shit and everything foreign is holy gets old after awhile. My brothers brand new Acura broke down more in 4 or 5 years than my 1972 Corvette did in over 30 years and almost 300k miles. My 1990 Taurus ran like brand new with 160k miles on it and I've never had a major failure with ANY of the domestic cars my family has ever owned, and we keep shit for a long time and too many miles too. Yes I happened to get a smoking deal on a like new 10 year old Toyota and guess what? There are websites full of all the engine problems and "this should be a recall" so like I've said before these things are ALL shitboxes. It also needed a bunch of warranty work right after I got it, the shocks were shot, the EGR was bad, etc, etc...the parts also cost about 4 times as much as my Ford did. I still say if you take care and do proper maintenance on any car, especially from the last 10 years or so onward it'll last forever.

For those of you who haven't, read Lee Iacocca's autobiography. It's very interesting and so is he. Alot of kids don't realize while we were pouring money into rebuilding Japan and defending their country they could spend all their money on developing their auto industy.

It's still inexcusable that GM and Ford and Dodge have been around as long as they have and don't produce higher rated products. I grew up around Chevy's but I put the most faith in Ford for the future. And while I used to waive the banner at this point in my life I buy what's best for me.

Oh and again in the interest of fairness I can write quite an essay on the horrible service and fuck ups and lies from a few simple courtesy oil changes from JM Lexus-the so called largest Lexus dealer in the world. They kept giving me more free services to apologize until I finally told them to fuck off and that I'd never bring my car there again because every time it was something else. Give the car back to me with a huge gash in the door, with the plastic engine undertray HANGING off in the street. They tried to tell me the fucking car wash did it! Its BOLTED with SIX bolts into the FRAME! They were ALL gone! The other side of that is that my uncle for years owned BMW's, Jags, Mercedes, and maybe 10 years ago was up for another new car and Caddy, BMW, Mercedes, etc all treated him like shit and Lexus kissed his ass and he never owned anything else but an LS Lexus after that simply because of the way he was treated. So it goes both ways.

Yes I like to take pride in what's made here but I don't care WHERE you go you're going to find morons and idiots, whether it be at the Pontiac dealer or the Honda or the Lamborghini dealer.

I am not waving any flags!!!

I'm simply saying don't knock it until you've tried it (or at least done your research.) I completely agree that you should buy the best thing for your money and conscience. Yes, it is unfortunate that the big 3 rode the wave of brand loyalty for so long, and it has finally bit them in the ass. But if people keep riding the wave of everything imported is the shiznit, they'll soon find there is nothing domestic left to purchase.

FWIW, I bought a new F150 in 2005 and loved it except for a few warranty issues that came up. But every experience at both dealerships I went to was a bad experience. It was the primary reason for me selling it 2 years later. I didn't see the point in paying for a warranty if they were unable/unwilling to repair it. (I have no experience from another brand to compare with.) Also I didn't want to be stuck 10 years from now trying to fix this unnecessarily overcomplicated crap myself (that would've applied to any brand of newer vehicle though). I "traded" it for a 1969 Chevy pickup and never looked back. I don't need or want automatic climate control and seat belt chimes and all that other b.s.

Everyone here seems sad that Buell is gone, but how many of you bought one? How many of you considered buying one before getting something else? (I didn't either.) It seems like everytime Buell comes up in the groups I ride, it's the butt of a joke, unless an actual Buell rider happens to be around, then it's all compliments. It seems like the general concensus is that "American Sportbike" was always an oxymoron. Well, it definitely is now.

I've got nothing against HD bikes or the guys who ride them. And I might have bouight a Buell if the 1125s came out before I bought my VTR.

I think Eric Buell is a genius who did amazing things considering that the stupid fucks who run Harley Davidson forced him to compete in the 21st century sport bike market with an engine essentially designed in the 1930s and more suited for agricultural equipment than a modern motorcycle.

What if HD had supported Buell developing or sourcing a liquid cooled motor 10 or 15 years ago instead of 25 years after every other sport bike on the planet had radiators?

Machines break, and sometimes for no apparent reason. So I get that comments here about how long one brand lasted one individual are really meaningless. I also do not blame the manufacturer for the occasional idiots found in a dealership. Those employees are local to an area and might even say more about the local town than about the auto mfg.
What TICKS me off was the design stupidity (from the owners perspective) of my Fords vs Hondas I owned. Yhe 96 Taurus I mentioned above - the maintenance called out changing the auto trans fluid and filter every 15000 miles. ??? Sup with that? Ok, NP I change my own oil, how hard can auto trans fluid be? Well, turns out there is no drain on the pan. Next it turns out there is about 20 tiny bolts (there were either 6mm or 8mm) holding the pan in place. Final insult? The freekin fluid level is above the pan height so when you loosen the bolts tranny fluid leaks out everywhere.
How about spark plugs? granted I only had to do it once, but that was enough to piss me off. I had to remove most of the intake manifold and associated parts to get to the back three plugs.
How about side mirrors? Hondas had folding mirrors since the 80's. Not my Taurus...
What was good about the Taurus? Mine in '96 it listed for $22k+ and yet two years later I bought it with 35k miles for $10,500. Good for me - don't know about the original owner...
I sold it for $2400 2-1/2 years later with 140k miles with a ticking starting in the valves.
I would like to buy American, but I won't pay for crap. I look for some sign of intelligence in the design.

maintenance called out changing the auto trans fluid and filter every 15000 miles. ??? Sup with that? Ok, NP I change my own oil, how hard can auto trans fluid be? Well, turns out there is no drain on the pan. Next it turns out there is about 20 tiny bolts (there were either 6mm or 8mm) holding the pan in place.

That is the design standard. Why add a drain plug (extra cost and another potential leak point) when the entire pan has to come off anyways for changing the filter? If they put just a drain plug on there people would be draining the fluid and not changing the filter (and then blaming Chevy/Ford/Whoever for their transmission going out at 120K.)

How about side mirrors? Hondas had folding mirrors since the 80's. Not my Taurus...

That's because Japan regulations require it. U.S. doesn't. Plus the folding mirrors of the 80s looked like ass, so I'm sure consumer would have demanded the fixed mirrors here anyways until the more modern designs that look better. I've seen exported Corvettes from the 80s, they did have folding mirrors, and it looks like ass. I'm also guessing that meant no power & defrost option.

Design standard??? Whose friggin standard? 15000 miles??? that once a year for most folks. it is rediculous. People seem to get their oil AND FILTER changed and still have an oil drain plug.
Apparently you do have a different opinion.
I won't put up with that crap. Time proved that even the US consumer wouldn't put up with it.
Stop defending marginal designs.
Why is it that until the mid '90s EVERY american designed car had a dash designed by one person and door panels by another? Close the door and it looked stupid or worse covered a speaker. Audi fixed that in 1985 by designing dashes that mated to door panel trim. Why does US Auto design FOLLOW others? and by decades.
The Japanese only copied (initially) but at least they copied quickly and intelligently.
The domestics have STARTED to get some of thier act together over this past decade - but unfortunately it was too little too late to weather this past year.
I am an American. I would like to be proud of my countries design and manufacturing. It pisses me off that the German automotive design is the best and Japanese in number two.
I won't subsidize crap when I have a choice. Get it right and I will buy it. So will others.

Design standard??? Whose friggin standard? 15000 miles??? that once a year for most folks. it is rediculous. People seem to get their oil AND FILTER changed and still have an oil drain plug.

Is your engine oil filter in the drain pan? BTW all those little bolts are used on stamped steel pans to keep the gasket compressed and prevent leaks. Try installing one at each corner and see how far you get.

Time proved that even the US consumer wouldn't put up with it.
Stop defending marginal designs. Not having transmission drain plugs is what killed the American auto industry? Sheesh. As for the rest, you're just generalizing, which is exactly the problem. I wouldn't even call it that really, as generalizing implies it's generally true. I had no complaints about the door panels on any of my older American cars. The only one that doesn't match is my 69 chevy pickup, but maybe that's because the interior isn't made of molded plastic. It also isn't a thousand degrees inside like any new car after sitting in the sun so all that plastic/foam/vinyl/soundproofing soaks up the heat and takes 20 minutes of blasting the a/c to cool it down. And now finally the Prius comes with a solar-powered ventilation system for $3600 to keep the car cool while parked in the hot sun. Genius.

it's hard to build a good reputation but easy to build a lousy reputation. for decades japanese cars were regarded as junk. it took a long time of designing and building good cars before toyota and honda overcame this. they earned it. gm, chrysler, and ford took the easy road... guess what, i still have only had NA vehicles!

buell. this is too bad. it seems to me that bike manus have to have a bottom line to survive but they shouldn't forget all else. are they bike people, or business people, or both?

harley is a joke. they sold out with their brand on everything from beer to kids dolls. status symbols for lawyer, doctors, everyone but real bikers. the few real bikers out there on harleys should be ashamed of the situation. i wonder if they're embarrassed to think they might look like a poser themselves!

I heard that the 1125 is selling here in WI for half retail. Shops are trying to just get them out the door.

I bought one of the original tube-frame Buells new in '97. I loved to ride that S-1 everywhere as a commuter, also saw double duty as a weekend long distance ride. Not as much top end or refinement as my 'hawk, but a damn good bike nonetheless. Threw a ton of mods at it due to the ease of wrenching on the archaeic old lump of sporty motor and really enjoyed it. Kinda like riding a American hotrod interpretation of a Ducati monster. Met Erik Buell in 2000 at a Battletrax event here in Mi. and was impressed with his drive and determination in working to see his dream succeed. I am truly saddened that h/d is now abandoning sportbikes especially due to the fact that it is one of the few types of bikes that are not currently stagnating in sales numbers as cruisers are. I hope that Erik and co. find a place to land on their feet in this unstable economy.

long story short, automotive arguments aside, no I never bought a buell, yes I considered them but anybody who does any research will see that the buell only has 3 advantages over a hawk: weight, brakes and torque. other than that, the hawk is comperable or superior in every other way. so of course I didn't buy one. I did appreciate them, and got smoked by a rotax buell at my last trackday so they got the goods. too little too late I guess. I have family members who ride harley. I have no motive to hate them other than straight cold objectivity. and that's enough. oh and people don't always say harley's suck because that's what they were told by someone else. the reason people have been saying harley's suck for so long is because THEY HAVE SUCKED FOR SO LONG! they have always been bad. and they are still bad. bring up your acceptions to the rule if you want but that's all they are. the RULE is: harley sucks ass and probably always will. deal with it. God bless america and watch over the absolute garbage we produce.

I have family members who ride harley. I have no motive to hate them other than straight cold objectivity. and that's enough. oh and people don't always say harley's suck because that's what they were told by someone else. the reason people have been saying harley's suck for so long is because THEY HAVE SUCKED FOR SO LONG! they have always been bad. and they are still bad. bring up your acceptions to the rule if you want but that's all they are. the RULE is: harley sucks ass and probably always will. deal with it. God bless america and watch over the absolute garbage we produce.

You're saying they probably always will suck ass? How is that "straight cold objectivity"?

I'm guessing your family members that ride Harley's don't think they suck. But of course, they're biased, and you're not. :rolleyes:

the RULE is: harley sucks ass and probably always will. deal with it. God bless america and watch over the absolute garbage we produce.

Wow this conversation just gets more and more intelligent doesn't it? Since that's the RULE please enlighten us-what exactly does a bike have to do to "suck ass?" I guess a dyna wide glide "sucks ass" because it won't turn a competitive lap time? "Sucks ass" compared to what? I worked at a Harley rental shop some years back. I never thought much of Harleys before that simply because they weren't my style and I never had much opportunity to ride them. Had a ton of fun riding them, and still love to whenever I get the chance. Sure they're different and need to be ridden a little different-they aren't sportbikes. Don't ever remember one of the bikes ever having any kind of mechanical issues besides when some fool would occasionally crash one. And swap from a Japanese cruiser and the quality and craftsmanship is just a step up on the Harley-PERIOD. They make Japanese cruisers feel "cheap." Kinda like swapping from my friend's Ducati made my Superhawk feel cheap. I'll let you in on a little secret...besides those who are a little more mature and open minded (usually those over 21 who went to college & don't post up on here asking if their superhawk will beat their buddies GSXR because they don't care), to much of the rest of the sportbike community a SUPERHAWK sucks ass. It's old, it's slow, etc, etc, blah, blah. Yet we love them because for what WE like they suit us just fine. I don't need some kid on his hayabusa to "educate" me on "how much better" his bike is because it makes 180hp. I can't stand that youtube comment mentality where what "I" like rules and everything else sucks ass. And yes I think the guys who ride Harleys who think everything else sucks are jackasses too. I won't even acknowledge your last assinine statement. I know how hip it is nowadays to knock everything that comes out of this country.

It pisses me off that the German automotive design is the best and Japanese in number two.


Actually if you read Consumer Reports you'll see that while new American cars have around twice as many reported problems as new Japanese makes do, GERMAN cars have twice as many reported problems as American cars do. I think it's safe to say the quality of the materials used is better than both American and Japanese cars, but you're paying for it. As far as "reliability" goes they're no better than anyone else. And as far as performance goes last time I checked the ZR1 and the CTS-V were about the fastest things out there around a track compared to their rivals. Still I think a new M3 exudes a build quality not to be found in a Corvette-at least in the interior, which is where most people spend most of their time. And I think the cheap feeling interiors in many American cars have gone a long way in carrying over to people's impression of the rest of the car.

Consumer goods are designed to wear out, and to go out of style. This keeps the consumer coming back for more.

How else would the economy function? ;)

My mechanic who works on my F250 wrecked his HD recently. He has been riding and customizing Harley's for years. He said he experienced the "Harley Wobble" that starts in the front end and works its way back. This happened after crossing a separation in a concrete highway. Is this fact or fiction? This would keep me from buying one. Besides the fact that they're not my bowl of chili.

Does anyone buy one of these for its handling characteristics? Or is ownership about identifying with a certain image? :)

Consumer Reports...:crackup::crackup::crackup:

Their highest rated cars are Lexus LS400, BMW 3 series, and Honda Accord.

Ummm.. wait.. so are mine! :eek:

I like the CTS - one of the few GM vehicles I admire. I'll wait 30 months and get one for 60% off.

Seriously though, this is a Motorcycle news topic on Buells. Tired of ranting about cars.
In my local Craigs list is a 2008 1125 for $5700! and I hear maybe that isn't such a hot price? Perhaps when it hits $4K I'll pick one up

I just picked up a black 2009 (new) 1125 for $5800. And I probably didnt even get the best deal....MSRP is $12,500 I believe.

That is what I am talking about! Who cares if you don't like a feature or the brand, for that price "suffer" through it ;)

I think Eric Buell is a genius who did amazing things considering that the stupid fucks who run Harley Davidson forced him to compete in the 21st century sport bike market with an engine essentially designed in the 1930s and more suited for agricultural equipment than a modern motorcycle.

What if HD had supported Buell developing or sourcing a liquid cooled motor 10 or 15 years ago instead of 25 years after every other sport bike on the planet had radiators?

Yes, yes, yes. EXACTLY. Lots of companies make lots of bad decisions, but it's the American companies that seem to so often make decisions that really seem totally insane. Really, HD? Air cooled motors from last millenium in some of the most innovative sportbikes ever produced? Ten Erik Buells couldn't overcome such stupidity.

Buell was really onto something with the Rotax, though I had hoped that an American firm would step up to the plate with a motor that could power its way out of a wet paper bag. I guess there's no chance of that now. Maybe if HD hadn't been so busy pissing cash away on MV Agusta they could've put it in R&D for a motor that, ya know, might've been mildly appropriate for a sportbike. Since, ya know, they already had money in a company that builds, well, sportbikes. I get so pissed thinking about the level of failure at HD sometimes that I get close to popping a blood vessel so I need to stop now.

The last thing I'll say is their cruisers seem just fine and up until the depression/recession even their stratospheric prices were in line with the market, if not in line with serious motorcycle enthusiasts. I guess we'll see if HD can weather this storm. Looking at their track record, I'm not optimistic.

That video is just too damn tragic. The whole thing is a damn shame.

Consumer Reports...:crackup::crackup::crackup:

Their highest rated cars are Lexus LS400, BMW 3 series, and Honda Accord.

Ummm.. wait.. so are mine! :eek:

I like the CTS - one of the few GM vehicles I admire. I'll wait 30 months and get one for 60% off.

Seriously though, this is a Motorcycle news topic on Buells. Tired of ranting about cars.
In my local Craigs list is a 2008 1125 for $5700! and I hear maybe that isn't such a hot price? Perhaps when it hits $4K I'll pick one upCTS-V

You're saying they probably always will suck ass? How is that "straight cold objectivity"?

I'm guessing your family members that ride Harley's don't think they suck. But of course, they're biased, and you're not. :rolleyes:

my family members that ride harley get out and ride about 5 times a year. so reliability isn't a requirement for them. and I said "probably" always suck. if they make some huge change and join the 21st century, then maybe my opinion will change. and yes, I am open to it changing. but how long do you hold out hope? they've been technologically behind for almost half a century. there is no reason to think they will improve. not since their last groundbreaker of implementing rubber mounts! talk about state of the art! buell was the only redeeming factor that harley had going for them in my opinion. I know I'm biased because I don't ride cruisers, but from my point of view, there is now officially no reason for harley to exist anymore.

Wow this conversation just gets more and more intelligent doesn't it? Since that's the RULE please enlighten us-what exactly does a bike have to do to "suck ass?" .

uhm, not run? leak oil? run poorly, employ ancient poorly designed tech, in general disappoint... let me know when I get to something harley's don't do.


I worked at a Harley rental shop some years back. I never thought much of Harleys before that simply because they weren't my style and I never had much opportunity to ride them. Had a ton of fun riding them, and still love to whenever I get the chance. Sure they're different and need to be ridden a little different-they aren't sportbikes. Don't ever remember one of the bikes ever having any kind of mechanical issues besides when some fool would occasionally crash one. .

and here is our token exception-to-the-rule story.

I'll let you in on a little secret...besides those who are a little more mature and open minded (usually those over 21 who went to college & don't post up on here asking if their superhawk will beat their buddies GSXR because they don't care), to much of the rest of the sportbike community a SUPERHAWK sucks ass. It's old, it's slow, etc, etc, blah, blah. Yet we love them because for what WE like they suit us just fine. I don't need some kid on his hayabusa to "educate" me on "how much better" his bike is because it makes 180hp. I can't stand that youtube comment mentality where what "I" like rules and everything else sucks ass. And yes I think the guys who ride Harleys who think everything else sucks are jackasses too. I won't even acknowledge your last assinine statement. I know how hip it is nowadays to knock everything that comes out of this country.

I don't know who you're refering to, I don't think any member of this forum falls within your description. you say hawkriders are different because they DO appreciate a bike that isn't the tip top performer that some repliracers are. so who does this rant apply to? me? I'd hope not. I'm well over 21, I went to college, I don't care about gixxers. and no, harley laptimes don't concern me. I don't watch youtube, I don't want a busa, and I think nearly every major bike manufacturer is fine. just not harley. and as for my last statement,

I won't even acknowledge your last assinine statement. I know how hip it is nowadays to knock everything that comes out of this country.

looks like an acknowledgement to me.

I love my country. that doesn't change the fact that when it comes to bikes, as of now, especially now that buell is gone, we have very little to offer the riders of the world. I'm not knocking everything that comes out of this country. no need to over-dramatize what I said. I guess I could have been more specific, but I assumed that it would be taken in context. so to clarify, harley, and just harley SUCKS. victory might but honestly I don't know. I know this dispute won't go anywhere. so respond if you want but I've said my peace. unless you respond with insults,(you'll notice I didn't) I won't be banging my drum on this issue again.

Anybody heard rumors that Yammie is looking at buying Buell?

http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/forum/showthread.php?t=97960

Now that I own an 08 xb12r I'm a bit pissed off...but what about
MV Agusta, I understand that HD owned a commanding share of them
as well as Buell

The sad thing about folks wishing for Harley and GM to die and implode is that the only people who will suffer from that are the masses of poor bastards who work there looking to feed their families. The handful of bastards who would actually be responsible for running the company into the ground I'm sure will all get huge severance packages and bonuses if that day ever comes.

Anybody heard rumors that Yammie is looking at buying Buell?

http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/forum/showthread.php?t=97960

I heard this one, but I don't know if yamaha is legally allowed to aquire buell. I don't know the legalities of it, but if they did aquire buell, that would be one of the best moves I've seen a big 4 manufacturer make in a long time. yamaha hasn't had a sport twin in a loooong time. I think the last one was in the early 90's? I'm sure some of you know better than me. how awsome would that be? I've officially got my fingers crossed.

The sad thing about folks wishing for Harley and GM to die and implode is that the only people who will suffer from that are the masses of poor bastards who work there looking to feed their families.

I'd rather cut out the middleman and pay them directly. How much of your tax dollars are left for subsidizing workers after the government and ceos take their cut?

Its unfortunate yes, but those poor bastards aren't entitled to shit if you ask me. The writing has been on the wall for a long time at GM. Those workers should be looking for a way out before its too late, not sucking on the teet until the milk dries out. I can't speak for Buell.

Hello Supply, meet demand...

I saw the Yamaha rumor too...some guy on a yamaha message board made it up and is having a good laugh now...

Looks like there's still a glimmer of life left in Buell.



http://www.sportrider.com/news/146_0911_erik_buell_leaves_harley_davidson_to_star t_erik_buell_racing/index.html

I'll bet that HD has tied him up with a non-competitive clause that prohibits him from doing anything with streetbikes - the whole situation stinks badly!

I just bought a VTR but kept my 2003 Buell Lightning. The Buell is a love / hate bike, folks either scowl when they seek it or love the looks. Personally I love the bike. Quirky, fairly quick with lot of bottom end and steers like a rabbit on ecstasy. Looks as goofy as fxxx but I like that.
And I feel sooo bad for Eric Buell....

I bought a 2000 buell x1 back then. So it had the sportster engine. It was a beautiful bike but had way too many issues. Oil leaks before I reached 500 miles. Front brakes warped the front rotor before I hit 1500 miles. The whole front brakes were replaced. Speedometer went out had to be replaced. After many times of taking it in for oil blowing out of the breather bolt. The dealer could never fix it. Until the warranty went out. Talked to the buell / hd reference getting the bike to stop spraying oil on my right leg they said I might need the topend freshened. I ask if they would do that. He said it would be at my expense. I then told him the bike is not barely a year old and the engine needs to be rebuilt. I told him what a piece of crap they sold and I would never buy anything from there company again. A week later I had a brand new rc 51. And never looked back. So I think buell/hd pretty much got what was coming to them. When you sell crap and dont stand by your product usually the consumers stop buying your product. It just took nine years.

+1 that would piss me off too. What did you expect, after all it was a Harley:p.

I believe he was under duress from HD, but if he wasn't he got what he deserved. I think when he started using the Rotax, he was comin around and probably his latest iterations were approximating higher quality, but that's my feelings, I really don't know.

Easton, although I love my Buell, if I had your experience with a bike and a dealer then I would feel the same....and yes, I would have the same opinion of Buell.
That said, my Lightning has been nothing but great, with no issues. Even on the Buell forums I read the horror stories and realise I must have got lucky!

I just bought a VTR but kept my 2003 Buell Lightning. The Buell is a love / hate bike, folks either scowl when they seek it or love the looks. Personally I love the bike. Quirky, fairly quick with lot of bottom end and steers like a rabbit on ecstasy. Looks as goofy as fxxx but I like that.
And I feel sooo bad for Eric Buell....

Although I never owned on I too ALMOST purchased a Buell Lightning. I loved the looks, size and the fact it was a twin. Wasn't thrilled with the power but understood the limitation of the motor.

So, somebody make a kit to fit that 1125 Rotax motor in there and I'll be the first to buy it.